Chat Transcript for 08/04/08 Part 1

IYan Writer: yay, here we go!
Michele Mrigesh: Here we go!
Phelan Corrimal: only if you plug your speakers in
Bjorlyn Loon: if you are on chatbridge on the web, please reload or refresh
Bjorlyn Loon: We encourage you to keep up a lively chat during today's show. We are using Intersection Unlimited's Chatbridge system to transmit local chat to our website and website chat into our event partners. Do keep in mind that wherever you are watching the show, your local chat is public, and will be seen at all event partner locations and on the web.
Olando7 Decosta: cacaphony? our highly structured backchat?
Rose Springvale: what a good word :)
Peter Krogstad: so workers rights can be discusssed as in content providers who need wages
Dizzy Banjo: w00t backchat rocks :D
Bjorlyn Loon: READ THE CHAT FROM ZEE LINDEN'S VISIT TO METANOMICS GROUP CHAT: http://metanomics.net/Aug1MetanomicsHighlights

JOIN THE METANOMICS GROUP ::|:: Touch this colored text to open the Metanomics group window, and JOIN ! secondlife:///app/group/a5b8e891-e990-9767-d73a-cbb0f0a87e46/about/
McCabe Maxsted: chat is the highlander O.o
Fleep Tuque: /me snickers at Olando7.
movies1963: how many viewers watch this live?
Bjorlyn Loon: Please visit Simuality, our primary Metanomics sponsor, at http://simuality.com/ and learn more about Slippcat, a revolutionary advertising vehicle. at http://www.slippcat.com/
Dahlia Trimble: Yay! I'm now immortal! :D
G2 Proto: Zha rules!
Bevan Whitfield: /me loves backchat!
movies1963: how many viewers watch this live?
Bjorlyn Loon: ZHA'S VIRTUAL MUSINGS: http://zhaewry.wordpress.com/
Lynnda Magic: ditto
Bjorlyn Loon: ABOUT THE ARCHITECTURE WORKING GROUP: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/About_AWG
Peter Krogstad: Roos Reynolds works at IBM are you here?
Sonja Strom: cacophony = "Harsh or discordant sound; dissonance."
Olando7 Decosta: linden is there as linden!
Olando7 Decosta: wOOt
Bjorlyn Loon: NOTES FROM THE FIRST AWG MEETING: http://blog.secondlife.com/2007/09/19/slgarchwg1/
Bjorlyn Loon: TO ASK YOUR QUESTIONS, type them in open local chat. Preface it with the word QUESTION:
Zha Ewry: Gently, and civilly ;-)
movies1963: QUSTION how many viewers watch this live?
Segun Ohtobide: ahhh watching it live now... better than trying to listen with voice.
Gjo Bing: Answer... define "live"
Olando7 Decosta: do NOT underestimate accountant professors!
Balpien Hammerer: QUESTION: have you worked out inventory transfer? Still pushing along the central server model?
kathee Gibbs: accountants love grafts lol
Troy McLuhan: I wonder what that connector at the very bottom right is
Eshi Otawara: /gawd i am so sleepy
Olando7 Decosta: okay I still understand it... a good sign....
CDB Barkley: looks like spaghetti Troy
Tao Takashi: I am sure 2 days off are enough :)
Celierra Darling: (Where's the agent domain? :P :P)
Be Ewing: /international docking platform
Zero Linden: Two whole weeks????
G2 Proto: lol
Nany Kayo: lol
G2 Proto: 2.5 weeks at least
Olando7 Decosta: the Metanomics Grid
bartelby Pegler: 1/2 time though
Malburns Writer: lol
Ailec Yates: is two linden weeks = 1 normal day?
Be Ewing: /intergalazy docking platform
Michele Mrigesh: well, that clears that up!
Raloc Dorado: Is video working for anyone here?
Tao Takashi: where is the Griefer domain?
Be Ewing: /intergalaxy *
Malburns Writer: Ha Tao
Balpien Hammerer: QUESTION: Are you going to authenticated distributed inventory blobs?
Phelan Corrimal: Depends if you are talking about development or trouble tickets :-)
Tao Takashi: I guess it's all over ;-)
Object: See you at Metanomics, Garth Corvale
Rose Springvale: /me is glad she can serve coffee and cake because she's already lost lol
Tara5 Oh: yes working for me
Peter Krogstad: question: where is the data logger? and who buys this data?
Bjorlyn Loon: FOR A MUCH MORE DETAILED FLOW CHART OF AN OPEN GRID TELEPORT: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/SLGOGP_Teleport_Strawman#Teleport_Flow
G2 Proto: its the first step in a journey of a 1000 steps
Bjorlyn Loon: ANNOUNCEMENT AND VIDEO FROM THE FIRST TELEPORT, JULY 8, 2008: http://blog.secondlife.com/2008/07/08/ibm-linden-lab-interoperability-an...
Bjorlyn Loon: TORLEY'S VIDEO:
http://torley.s3.amazonaws.com/Across-the-Metaverse.mp4
Leondra Larsson: yes.... we are born naked
Be Ewing: /similar to quantum teleportation:)
Bjorlyn Loon: SECOND LIFE BLOG ON OPEN GRID PUBLIC BETA: http://blog.secondlife.com/2008/07/31/open-grid-public-beta-begins-today...
CDB Barkley: mmm SL cookies....
Scimitar/just wear: releasing controls
Tammy Nowotny: we cd rezz trees on OpenSim... a random tree each time
Bjorlyn Loon: ABOUT OPENSIM, THE SERVER DESTINATION FOR THE FIRST TELEPORT:
http://opensimulator.org/wiki/Grid_List
Olando7 Decosta: agent name is a nice name, kind of mysterious
Fleep Tuque: Can we get high res copies of those slides somewhere? (Admit I haven't looked at all the links provided yet!)
Olando7 Decosta: agent domain
Nany Kayo: agent domain is a good name
Phelan Corrimal: ANS?
Balpien Hammerer: too geeky
Sean McDunnough: /hmm... who controls the agent domain?
Phelan Corrimal: how about Bob then?
Be Ewing: /oops ... OSGrid sounds very IBM-like :)
Bjorlyn Loon: only because you are hearing the voice, Aki.
Zha Ewry: Mutiple possible agent domains.. as the grid evolves
Peter Krogstad: Question: how about shared privacy settings and like wise access rules
Phelan Corrimal: I'm thinking similar to Domain Name Servers
Be Ewing: -- it does clear up things tremendously ... thank you
Phelan Corrimal: only not run by Network Solutions
Tao Takashi: once they implement OpenID...
Olando7 Decosta: user centric control, nice concept
Fleep Tuque: Very good analogy there.
Fleep Tuque: Have to remember that one.
Tao Takashi: and in effect the DataPortability Group and others are trying to push all those services in order to put the users in control of their data again
Dirk Talamasca: haven't heard that til now Fleep?
Be Ewing: /this does make a lot of sense
Leondra Larsson: that..................... is VERY cool
Fleep Tuque: Didn't really think of it in that particular way, in the sense that my Flickr account is not "met" but Fleep Tuque IS me.
Fleep Tuque: ;)
Bjorlyn Loon: SECOND LIFE WIKI FOR THE OPEN GRID PUBLIC BETA: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Open_Grid_Public_Beta
Tao Takashi: The problem might be that at some point some businesses will close it down
Fleep Tuque: er not "me" typonese!
Tao Takashi: because businesses like walled gardens
Peter Krogstad: Question: Privacy laws differ by country...can this be respected?
Tao Takashi: the tech for doing it open is already there also for flickr and co.
Be Ewing: - they showed it could be done in quanutm lab
Phelan Corrimal: I think only in so far as Domain Names are currently respected
Be Ewing: /now they are trying to expand that???
Phelan Corrimal: So it would need to be a similar concept - an Agent Name Server set-up where people register their avatar and personal identity
Nany Kayo: I dont understand why it matters to have the same account if the avatar and plaform dont behave the same way.
Fleep Tuque: QUESTION: I often feel overwhelmed by the TECHNICAL components of this conversation and lose sight of what the implications are for the SOCIAL components. Can you summarize some of the controversies around intellectual property and other social concerns?
Tao Takashi: start with your profile information
kathee Gibbs: Dave's cute LOL
Phelan Corrimal: having some method to verify that a person is who they say they are. So while Fleep may not be Fleep in all social networking environments - the person behind Fleep needs some protections
Tao Takashi: you might not want to enter it over and over again
Tara Yeats: Protocol = MIDI for the world of digital music creation
Phelan Corrimal: in terms of both accountability and verification
Tao Takashi: or finding your friends
Tao Takashi: basically to get around the mess we have with social networks already
Tao Takashi: there is always some data which can be reused
Fleep Tuque: nod Phelan, that's true
Peter Krogstad: Comment: It would be cool if my Eve Online pilot could buy clothers in SL
Nany Kayo: I may not want the same info on every website I use. I may want to be an idiot on one and a professional on another
Bjorlyn Loon: /me waves at Rockcliffe partner, thanks for being there Phelan!
Geo Meek: :-)
Dirk Talamasca: So just have 2 accounts. You still can
Dizzy Banjo: thats an important dimension fleep
Phelan Corrimal: yes -- keep in mind we still have a very politically based issue in that governments and government policy is still regionally based but yet virtual agents are global without respect for political boundaries
Tammy Nowotny: QUESTION what if soemone wanst to sue the same name you are already using
Bjorlyn Loon: IN A *WONDERFUL* ARTICLE BY TISH SHUTE (TARA5 OH IN SL) SHE ASKED ZERO LINDEN WHAT THE ROADMAP FOR THE NEXT FEW MONTHS WOULD BE: http://www.ugotrade.com/2008/07/31/the-open-grid-beta-the-first-step-to-...
Dirk Talamasca: But if you are a professional you don't want someone else representing you elsewhere do you?
Nany Kayo: seems like limited usefulness for the amount of attention this feature is getting
Bjorlyn Loon: TO ASK YOUR QUESTIONS, type them in open local chat. Preface it with the word QUESTION:
Phelan Corrimal: Exactly Dirk - so there needs to be some way to ensure that someone can't "spoof" you like you could a domain name
Be Ewing: /so essentially we are back about in 1995 with first generation of internet after ARPANET?
Peter Krogstad: Comment: I think C# is closed language not open?
Fleep Tuque: /me laughs at Zero's comment.
Be Ewing: /except we are in Web 2.0?
Peter Krogstad: Comment : Glad you guys are being paid wages
Fleep Tuque: Open open open = volunteers, confusion, many conversations = welcome to distributed work!
Phelan Corrimal: paid?
Pavig Lok: QUESTION: does the protocol/spec have hooks in it for merging/linking existing accounts from seperate grids?
Tao Takashi: right, there needs to be ways to make sure that server A knows that you are indeed the avatar from server B you claim to be
Phelan Corrimal: probably means doing something like having a certification server using SSL 128 encryption and establishment of a trust certficate between your current IP / MAC address and the system you are connecting to
Azwaldo Villota: Question: How will it seem to a typical user, crossing from one grid to another? (What buttons, what selections made?)
movies1963: QUSTION............Is Linden Lab working this hard with IBM on this to A,draw other coporatitions to intest in sims and B to show a real value of Linden Lab so they can launch an IPO and if so shouldn't you be working on other real issues in here instead to make SL stable?
hooligandollinger: QUESTION: slight digression but can either comment on the IBM private (behind a corporate firewall) server for SL that they said they were working on with LL earlier this year (at VW's conference this past Spring).
movies1963: QUSTION............Is Linden Lab working this hard with IBM on this to A,draw other coporatitions to intest in sims and B to show a real value of Linden Lab so they can launch an IPO and if so shouldn't you be working on other real issues in here instead to make SL stable?
Tao Takashi: Phelan: might be something like OAuth or so. That basically should allow something like that
Balpien Hammerer: Phelan, MAC addresses can be easily changed...
movies1963: QUSTION............Is Linden Lab working this hard with IBM on this to A,draw other coporatitions to intest in sims and B to show a real value of Linden Lab so they can launch an IPO and if so shouldn't you be working on other real issues in here instead to make SL stable?
Tammy Nowotny: what is a MAC address?
Dig Denimore: ip's can change to. change with mac adress with some isp
Leather Belt v1.2: Rezzing your belt - resetting scripts...
Be Ewing: /linden Lab -- not LInden Labs :)
Tao Takashi: this is the unique identification number of your network card
Leather Belt v1.2: Control this SpiritFilled Belt with chat commands like:
Phelan Corrimal: your Ip and Mac do not have to be static -- so for example - the mac address of my network card in my laptop is different from the one in my desktop
Leather Belt v1.2: larger,smaller,largerhip,smallerhip,color,colorlist,lighton,lightoff
Peter Krogstad: Comment: secure connection is all my workplace might be able to use
Balpien Hammerer: Mac addresses are not unique... Just a piece of flash mem.
Tao Takashi: but as said by others, it can be changed as well
Tammy Nowotny: QUESTIN: what do you do to prevent cybersquatting names... and also how do you manage the case where multiple people want to use he same name?
hooligandollinger: now not holding my breath anymore....
Ricken Flow: Question: Has there been a discussion started on the economics i.e if another open sim starts a currency and how that will convert to Linden Dollars?
Tammy Nowotny: griefers etc. can and do use multiple machines... as do real epople... MAC address doesn't tell you much, if I understand correctly
Tao Takashi: Tammy: probably it will not just be a name with which you identify some person, it might be name and the AgentDomain it comes from
movies1963: QUSTION is this being done so Linden Lab can launch an IPO by trying to show a real value to corprate America instead of working on stability?
Phelan Corrimal: So you authenticate to a certificate server your current IP and MAC address when you first log into a system. You are issued a trust certificate and then that is used to uniquely identify you for the duration of taht session
movies1963: QUSTION is this being done so Linden Lab can launch an IPO by trying to show a real value to corprate America instead of working on stability?
Fleep Tuque: Movies, I'm sure your question was seen the first couple times. :)
Balpien Hammerer: Yes, developing a trust relation works better, though a TPM ensures a solid relationship.
Dizzy Banjo: lol
Peter Krogstad: Comment: Yes Linden Lab needs a future and it is good they contribute to open source
movies1963: another voice heard from in charge eh?
Tao Takashi: What was that question? ;-)
Tara5 Oh: Aaaaw my flight is being called I will miss the end of this!
Phelan Corrimal: The key issue is whether someone can hi-jack a secure session once it is established
G2 Proto: great answer
Olando7 Decosta: QUESTIOn: would Linden Lab become a vendor of virtual worlds solutions and eventually spin off Second Life?
Tara5 Oh: Thanks Metanomics! Zeor and Zha! Bye.
JenzZa Misfit: ** Please post your question ONCE --- and I will get it to Beyers ::
Tao Takashi: cya Tara5!
Tao Takashi: have a good flight!
Dahlia Trimble: bye Tara5 :)
Fleep Tuque: Bye Tara, good flight!
Bevan Whitfield: fly safe Tara!
Tammy Nowotny: fly safe Tara
Phelan Corrimal: how is Linden Labs protecting themselves from Google and Macrosquish turning an protocol developed by IBM/second life into another CORBA?
Fleep Tuque: Excellent response, Zha
bartelby Pegler: @phelan ewwww
Fleep Tuque: Phelan, can you explain CORBA for those who have no idea what that is? :)
Azwaldo Villota: Olando7: is that what SL Grid is?
movies1963: FleepI'm sure they saw my qustion too now let's see if they address it
Nany Kayo: sounds kinda like openism has more to do with the platform providers' business than the platform users needs.
Phelan Corrimal: CORBA is the acronym for Common Object Request Broker Architecture, OMG's open, vendor-independent architecture and infrastructure that computer applications use to work together over networks. Using the standard protocol IIOP, a CORBA-based program from any vendor, on almost any computer, operating system, programming language, and network, can interoperate with a CORBA-based program from the same or another vendor, on almost any other computer, operating system, programming language, and network.
Leondra Larsson: hope so
Dahlia Trimble: Nany, you can run your own private region at home with Opensim
Phelan Corrimal: The problem is that as soon as Microsoft started to get involved they started to railroad the process by playing hardball with all the other players
Be Ewing: /they do not sell land easily at all
Bjorlyn Loon: WHUMP LINDEN’s WEBSITE: http://www.whump.com/moreLikeThis/ WHUMP RUNS THE OPEN GRID PUBLIC BETA.
Segun Ohtobide: QUESTION: Do we all see the Open GRID and Secondlife platform being the next Internet?
Benjamin Noble: Right. I mean, how many people host their own web pages? And that's fairly simple.
Segun Ohtobide: ?
Bjorlyn Loon: ugotrade.com identified the Linden players in the project as: Hamilton Linden, who is leading the Open Platform Product Group (OPPG) as Director, Engineering for Linden Lab , Tess Linden, Technical Director, leads design and Implementation for the OPPG, and Layla Linden has been getting the agent domain ready. Periapse Linden is project manager for OPPG. Whump Linden is managing the Open Grid Public Beta. Whump is also a very interesting contributor, I think, to the evolution of the Open Grid. Enus Linden and Infinity Linden are working on testing tools known as the PyOGP test harness
Jacek Antonelli: /me is going to make JacekLand next weekend. ;D
Malburns Writer: Withsome I believe Dahlia - TribalNet for example
Peter Krogstad: TY MS Loon
Bjorlyn Loon: Whump also wanted to mention all the Gridnauts, including BlueWall Slade, Pixel Gausman, Tao Takashi, Emma Nowhere, Julie Wasserstrom, Chris Samtanko, Gomez Bracken, Torrid Luna, McCoy Ducatillon, Vicero Lambert, Dahlia Trimble, Saijanai Kuhn
Whump Linden: and Adam Zaius!
Nany Kayo: ok. It just sounds like Linden Labs is concerned with maintaining links to other virtual worlds platorms in order to not lose users to some other platform.
Saitek Blanco: QUESTION: Is Google playing?
Bjorlyn Loon: and I want to especially thank Dahlia, Twa, Saijanai, and Prospero for helping with all these pastes and the article at http://www.metanomics.net/Event080408
Harper Beresford: Losing? more people are entering, presumably
Bjorlyn Loon: IBM's PRESS RELEASE: http://www-304.ibm.com/jct03006c/press/us/en/pressrelease/24589.wss
Tara Yeats: hehe John
Bjorlyn Loon: Interoperability is a key component of the 3D Internet and an important step to enabling individuals and organizations to take advantage of virtual worlds for commerce, collaboration, education, operations and other business applications, said Colin Parris, Vice President, Digital Convergence, IBM. Developing this protocol is a key milestone and has the potential to push virtual worlds into the next stage of their evolution.
Phelan Corrimal: Google, Sony, Sun are all developing their own systems -- none are as advanced as Linden Labs currently - but they are essentially all trying to play